Middle
Kingdom - Internal Letter of Acceptances & Returns – December 2002
This is the December 2002 Middle Kingdom Letter of Acceptances and Returns for Escutcheon and Keythong’s October Letters. Unless otherwise noted, all clients will accept changes. {Comments in braces {} were removed from the Letter of Intent sent to Laurel and the College of Arms. Names, devices, or badges in braces have been returned or pended; general comments or replies to commentary are also placed in braces. Thanks to Aryanhwy merch Catmael, Knut, Thorvald Redhair, Ćlfreda ćt Ćthelwealda, Mikhail of Lubelska, John ap Wynne, Richenda de Jardin, Giovanna d’Ests, Guillermo d’Este, Emma Foster, Thorgrim Bjornsson, Percival ap Gwylim Trefanwy, Gabriel Ximenez de Malaga, Kr˙st˙na Mihal, Konrad Mailander, Juliane de St. Thomas, Yasamin al-Hadiyya, Pat, and Jaelle of Armida for their commentary this month.}
{*) Alfred Gatebreaker. New Name and Device. Per fess argent and azure, a hammer inverted to chief gules, a two towered gate Or.
Ary:
Simply citing sources and page numbers is not documentation; dates and
spellings must also be listed. Withycombe cites Alfred the Great 849-901,
but this is most likely normalized, as all other spellings from that
period and slightly after are Latin. Given the Latin forms from 1086-1303,
<Alfred> is probably registerable. I do not have a copy of Jonsjo,
so I can't look up <Gatebreaker>. It is not in Reaney & Wilson.
Richenda: Alfred is the header
form in Withycombe. We were unable to find any dates for this spelling
but were able to find Alfraid the Great (849-901), Alueredus (1086),
and Alfridus (1286). We were able to find Alfred in the submitter’s
spelling in Talan Gwynek’s “Given Names from Early 13th Century
England” (http://www.s-gabriel.org/names/talan/eng13/eng13m.html). We could not find any documentation
(outside of Jonsjo, which we do not have) for Gatebreaker, even as a
plausible construction.
Gabriel: As far as we can tell,
the name is fine.
Ary:
Blazon-fu: "Per fess argent and azure, a Thor's hammer inverted
gules and a two towered gate Or." There is no need to specify that
the hammer is in chief, since two charges in pale is the default for
a field divided per fess, and each charge will fall where it does based
on their tincutres.
Thorvald: If this is a Thor’s
hammer, it is in its default position. According to the PicDic, the
Thor’s hammer has a particular style, which is not represented by
this miniature. This just a hammer inverted.
Knut: Per fess argent and azure, a Thor’s hammer inverted to chief gules, a two towered gate Or.
[A portcullis between and conjoined to two towers] The primary charge is blazoned [as noted] for the sake of the cant [with Gate's Edge], but is indistinguishable from a castle (Canton of Gate's Edge, September, 1992, pg. 7)
Precedents - Bruce, under Castle
Richenda: I recommend reblazoning the Thor’s hammer as a hammer as it does not have anything that distinguishes it from a standard hammer. The gate should be reblazoned as a two-towered castle.
Gabriel: The device is clear
of conflicts.
Konrad: Suggest blazon - Per
fess argent and azure, a Thors hammer gules, a two towered gate Or.
A Thors hammer by default is handle to the chief. The charge as depicted
it is not the heraldic charge a Thors hammer but just a hammer. So
this is probably better: Per fess argent and azure, hammer inverted
gules, a two towered gate Or.
1) Anna Lyse Warwick. New Name.
Ary:
From the precedents of Da'ud II: "There is ample evidence of period
German use of double given names. (Anne Liese Wolkenhaar, 5/96 p. 5)."
German/English combinations were ruled a weirdness on the 11/01 LoAR.
The client should be aware that <Anna Lyse von Marburg> would
be registerable if that's what she indeed wished (perhaps this can be
pended so Rouge Scarpe can find out), but that it's awfully close to
<Annalies Maria von Marburg>, registered 09/01 via Caid. The spelling
<Annalies>, if this is what she is going for, is dated to 1634
in Seibicke. The precedents of Francois state: "Colm Dubh found
a citation of Annalies in 1634 (Wilfred Seibicke, *Historisches Deutsches
Vornamenbuch*), which is in our "gray area" of documentation.
Therefore we will allow the compound given name. We will, however, only
allow it in the listed spelling (barring documentation that another
spelling is a valid period variant). [Annalies Grossmund, 10/99, A-Calontir]."
Richenda: The documentation
for Anna is as stated. We were unable to find Lyse in that documentation
as suggested, but were able to find it in Talan Gwynek’s “15th
Century German Women’s Names” article (http://www.s-gabriel.org/docs/german15f.html). We were able to find additional
documentation of Warwick in Reaney and Wilson, s.n. Warwick, with Richard
de Warewic (1196) and Churchill Waruuic (1086).
Gabriel: Operating under the assumption that she wanted <Warwick> as a surname, we documented <Warwick> in “A Dictionary of English Surnames”, Reaney & Wilson, Third Edition, page 477. That spelling was not dated however. The spelling found was <de Warewic> dated to 1196, and <de Waruuic> dated to 1086.
Konrad: No documentation of Warwick provided whilst documentation for the surname [von Marburg] was, but must go by the name on the form. Client cares most about sound and wants a 14th century name.
Too bad, von Marburg would
make for a better name than the mixed German/English with Warwick.
{*) Beathag Corwyna the Corsair. New Name and Device. Per chevron argent and sable, two daggers in chevron and a lymphad under full sail counterchanged.
Ary:
Note that the site cited for the given name <Beathag> is no longer
available, as it has been superceded by "Scottish Gaelic Given
Names" (6Nov01 update) (http://www.medievalscotland.org/scotnames/gaelicgiven/). The only evidence for <Beathag>
is a woman recorded in Scots as <Beak> in 1571. The article says
this about this record: "The particular spelling <Beak> may
(or may not) be because it was an attempt to phonetically render a Gaelic
form of the name; then again, it may be that it is a weird form of <Bege>/<Beigis>,
a Scots language diminutive of Margaret (similar to the English diminutive
<Peg> and <Peggy>)." Given the speculative nature of
the evidence, <Beak> might be a better choice to go with than
<Beathag>. I highly doubt that <Corwyna> is registerable.
There is no evidence for either the masculine or the feminine form in
period, and while the masculine form <Corwin> has been ruled SCA-aceptable
(cf "Corwin was ruled SCA-compatible in the cover letter for the
December 1985 LoAR. [Corwin of Saxony, 11/01, A-Ansteorra]" from
the precedents of Francois), the feminine form has never been. Reaney
& Wilson has no surname from <Corsair>; the most similar in
sound is <le Corser> 1227 s.n. Corser. <Beak le Corser>
would be a registerable Scots/English name with just one weirdness for
the combination of languages, but it's fairly far removed from her original
submission and does not retain the meaning.
John: Beathag: see Conway (61); Zaczek (15); Norman (114, 119,128) lists this as one of the most common female names in Scotland between 843-1542.
Richenda: We recommend returning
this name for the element Corwyna. The issue of accepting feminized
versions of men’s names determined to be SCA-compatible is currently
in the final decision-making process. Pelican has tentatively decided
to end the registration of such names in April 2003. Our argument to
you is that this name contains two weirdnesses: an SCA-compatible name,
and the feminization of a masculine name with no commonly used feminine
form.
Gabriel: Arval’s page has been removed. It has been superceded by http://www.medievalscotland.org/scotnames/gaelicgiven/women.shtml “Scottish Given Names for Women”, Sharon L. Krossa. However, <Beathag> is listed as a “speculative pre-1600 Scottish Gaelic spelling.”
<Corwyna> could not be documented, however, <Corwen> can be documented as an English surname, dated to 1483, in Reaney & Wilson, Third Edition, page 109. <Corsair> was documented as < Corsales> dated to 1549, <Coursayres> dated to 1588, and <Corsaries> dated to 1599 from the OED, online edition.
Thorvald:
The lymphad is missing its identifying oars. This might be similar to
the beard on a unicorn.
Knut: Per chevron argent and sable, two daggers in chevron and a lymphad under full sail counterchanged.
Richenda: We regret recommending
the return of the name as we really like the armory. It appears to
be free of conflict.
{*) Border Keep, Canton of. New Group Name.
Ary:
The precedent concerning the SCA-acceptability of <Keep> is as
follows: "*Keep* has long been used as part of SCA branch names.
The most recent registration is *Crossrode Keep, Shire of* (registered
November 1999 via Ansteorra). This element is effectively regarded as
SCA compatible as an element in an English place name. Given the forms
in which it has been registered, spellings of the element *Keep* are
registerable both as a separate element (such as *Crossrode Keep*),
and as the final element in a compound place name (such as *Northkeep*).
Registerable spellings include *Keep* and any alternate spellings which
may be documented to period (including those listed above)." I'm
not sure about <Border Keep> as a reasonable placename for "keep
on the border," but since the allow the meaning "keep of the
man named Border," this could reasonably be changed to <Borderskeep>,
which, while not great, is probably registerable.
Richenda: We reviewed the documentation
and it is as stated in the LoI.
Gabriel: Conflicts with: Border
Vale Keep, Shire of (April of 1985 (via Meridies)). Rules for Submission
V.2.c.: Conflict of Names with Different Numbers of Elements - Two non-personal
names with different numbers of descriptive elements conflict if the
only difference in the descriptive parts is the addition of one or more
modifiers to a single, already modified root element.
{*) Brandrmeir Grimeau de Mortaigne. New Name and Device. Per pale azure and sable, three fleurs-de-lis in pall bases to center argent
The device is fine, but
must be returned with the name.}
Ary:
<Brandrmeir> looks like a compound Norse given name, using the
element <Brandr>. <Brandr> is found 20 times in the Landnamabok,
according to "Viking Names found in the Landnámabók" (http://www.sit.wisc.edu/~sfriedemann/names/landnamabok.htm), making it quite popular. The element
<-meir> is not found in any name. <Grimeau> looks French;
the closest I can find are the given names <Grimon> and <Grymond>,
in "Names Found in Commercial Documents from Bordeaux, 1470-1520"
(http://www.sit.wisc.edu/~sfriedemann/names/bordeaux.htm), the surnames <Grimel> and
<Grimoneau>, in the same source, and the surname <Degrimaupont>
or <Degrimonpon> in "French Names from 1601" (http://www.sit.wisc.edu/~sfriedemann/names/french1601.htm). <de Moretaign'> and <de
Mortaine> are recorded in 1187 and 1219 respectively, according to
Reaney & Wilson s.n. Morten. The first is most likely a scribal
form of <de Moretaigne>. <Grimon de Moretaigne> would be
a reasonable French name, but it's a far stretch from where he started.
Richenda: We recommend returning
this name for several reasons. 1. We have been unable to find any
documentation of the given name element Brandrmeir in any language.
We even did a Google search and only find this name as a form of the
above name. 2. We have been unable to find documentation for Grimeau.
Our closest documentation was in Dauzat and Rostaing s.n. Grimaucourt-en-Woevre.
There we found Girmaud de Grimaldo (980). We did not exhaustively search
the Saint Grabriel Library or Arval’s site, however; therefore there
is a possibility that we missed some documentation. We were able to
find an undated citation for Mortaigne in Morlet, s.n. Mortagne, as
a territory in Gaul.
Gabriel: As was said by a member
of this group “don’t stick multiple cultures into a blender and pull
out a name”. The best we can come up with is that the client wants a
Norse-French name. However, we are unable to document this. This needs
to be returned for ANY documentation.
Ary:
- This arrangement of flerus-de-lys has been registered before, and
fairly recently, in the blazon provided by Escutcheon.
Knut: Per pale azure and sable, three fleurs-de-lis in pall bases to center argent
Richenda: This appears to
be free of conflict.
Gabriel: Nice arms, and clear
of conflicts.
2) Domnall Ó hOdhráin. New Name.
Domnall is found in Ó Corráin
& Maguire (75) and described as “the ninth most popular name in
Early Ireland.” The byname is found in MacLysaght (161, under “Horan”).
The entry says, “the name of this north Connacht sept is also widely
used for Haren and to some extent for Hourihan.” No dates are provided,
but MacLysaght’s Gaelic forms are generally period, so this is probably
registerable.
Ary:
The URL for the website documenting the given name is actually "Index
of Names in Irish Annals" (http://www.s-gabriel.org/names/mari/AnnalsIndex/), not the URL cited on the LoI. <Domnall>
is an extremely popular Irish masculine name; there are 44 examples
of men with this name in the Irish Annals, ranging from 862 to 1592.
The submitted spelling is the pre c1200 form; the spelling appropriate
for the 14th century would be <Domhnall>. The source cited for
the surname is not sufficient; however, they do cross-reference the
name with <(O) Horan>, which is in MacLysaght; he gives the Gaelic
as <Ó hOdhráin>, saying "the name of this north Connacht
sept is also widely used for Haren and to some extent for Hourihan."
This doesn't give any dates, but MacLysaght's Gaelic forms are generally
period, so this is probably registerable.
John: Domnall: see Conway (38-39); Zaczek (74); Todd (106); O’Corran/Maguire (75)
O’hOdhrain: closest I can
find is O’Corrain/Maguire (148), Todd (144)
Richenda: The documentation
for Domnall is as stated on the LoI. However, the documentation provided
for the surname is inadequate. This is a commercial site and does not
contain any dates or source listing. We were able to find an undated
citation in MacLysaight for O hOdhrain (the submitter’s given spelling)
under the name (O) Horan.
Gabriel: <Domnall> found
in O Corrain and Maguire, page 75. < Ó hOdhráin> is found in MacLysaght,
“The Surnames of Ireland”, Fifth Edition, page 161, under “(O) Horan”.
Both names are undated.
3) Elinor Larke le Dauncer. New Device. Argent, two natural leopards combatant guardant azure spotted argent between in chief a mullet gules and in base a sun purpure.
Ary:
Unfortunately, by drawing the mullet large to match the sun rather than
drawing the sun smaller to match the mullet, this now has three different
types of charges (sun, mullet, leopards) in the same charge group, so
this must be returned for slot-machine heraldry.
Knut: Argent, two natural leopards combatant guardant azure spotted argent between in pale a mullet gules and a sun purpure.
Richenda: We are not sure if
she created a separate problem while trying to respond to Rouge Scarpe’s
initial reason for return. In this emblazon we feel she is perilously
close to slot machine heraldry. If this were a single leopard, the
consensus of the commenters was to recommend returning it as such.
Given that this is a group primary, it is more difficult to say. Perhaps
part of the problem stems from the top-heaviness of the drawing.
Gabriel: This device should be returned. Rules of Submission VIII.1: Armorial Simplicity: All armory must be simple in design.
b. Armorial Balance: Armory must arrange all elements coherently in a balanced design. “Period armory usually places the primary elements of the design in a static arrangement, such as a single charge in the center of the field or three identical charges on an escutcheon. More complex designs frequently include a central focal point around which other charges are placed, like a chevron between three charges, but the design remains static and balanced. Designs that are unbalanced, or that create an impression of motion, are not compatible with period style.”
Konrad: What keeps this from
being slot machine?
4) Flaithrí Ó Cearnaigh. New Name and Device. Or, three chevronels interlaced sable, overall a fox rampant gules.
Ary:
Again, simply citing titles and page numbers is not documentation. OCM
s.n. Flaithrí says that "This name was relatively common in the
early period but it survived into the early modern period," citing
a king of Connacht from c777 and an archbishop from 1560-1629. <Ó
Cearnaigh> is found in MacLysaght s.n. (O) Kearney, which says that
<Ó Cearnaigh> is "the name of two septs now called <Kearney>
(or <Carny in Connacht), viz. of the <Ui Fiachrach> and of
the <Dal gCais>; the latter migrated to Cashel."
John: Client’s sources are
okay for both names.
Richenda: We were able to find
additional documentation fro Flaithri from Mari Elspeth nic Bryan’s
article “Dated Full Names Found in Ó Corráin & Maguire's
Irish Names” (http://www.s-gabriel.org/names/mari/ocm/). In addition we were able to confirm
that the documentation for O Cearnaigh
Knut: Or, three chevronels interlaced sable, overall a fox rampant gules.
5) Galen the Mad. Change of Registered Device. Argent, upon a saltire nowy quadrate sable cotised purpure, a hawk’s head erased argent.
Knut: Argent, upon a saltire nowy quadrate sable cotised gules, a hawk’s head erased argent.
Richenda: We question the
use of nowy quadrate with saltire without further documentation of this
as a period heraldic motif. However, this motif was registered to the
submitter in 1987 and therefore would be covered under the grandfather
clause regardless of the decision of its registerability. This was
the only registration of the saltire nowy quadrate motif. We recommend
sending this to Wreath with this question.
Ćlfreda: The submittor already
has a registered device (reg 11/87) "Azure, on a saltire nowy quadrate
argent, cotised Or, a bull's head cabossed sable."
6) Galen the Mad. New Badge. Azure, a saltire nowy quadrate argent cotised Or.
Knut: Azure, a saltire nowy quadrate argent cotised Or.
Richenda: We question the
use of nowy quadrate with saltire without further documentation of this
as a period heraldic motif. While this motif was registered to the
submitter in 1987, it was registered with a tertiary. This was the
only registration of the saltire nowy quadrate motif. We are not certain
if this would qualify under the grandfather clause, if a decision is
made to disallow its registerability. We recommend sending it to Wreath
with this question.
7) Galen the Mad. New Badge. Argent, a saltire nowy quadrate sable cotised purpure.
Knut: Argent, a saltire nowy quadrate sable cotised gules.
Richenda: We question the
use of nowy quadrate with saltire without further documentation of this
as a period heraldic motif. While this motif was registered to the
submitter in 1987, it was registered with a tertiary. This was the
only registration of the saltire nowy quadrate motif. We are not certain
if this would qualify under the grandfather clause, if a decision is
made to disallow its registerability. We recommend sending it to Wreath
with this question.
8) Iosobal inghean Uilliam mhic Leoid. New Name.{and Device. Quarterly checky azure and argent and Or, a frog salient vert.}
John: Iosobail: see Todd (490)
Richenda: Arval Benicoeur’s article, cited in the LoI, has been superceded by Effric neyn Kenyeoch vc Ralte’s “Scottish Gaelic Given Names” article (http://www.medievalscotland.org/scotnames/gaelicgiven/ still in draft). Effric neyn Kenyeoch vc Ralte’s “Scottish Gaelic Given Names” article (http://www.medievalscotland.org/scotnames/gaelicgiven/ last updated 28 August 2002) lists this name as probably from 1501-1600, but does not yet have documentation of this spelling. The spellings she documents are from the Book of the Dean of Lismore:
When reviewing the Symon Freser article, we discovered that the LoI had a typo in the article URL. The correct URL is: http://www.s-gabriel.org/names/symonFreser/scottish14/scottish14_given.html The article does provide documentation of some form of William, but not beginning with “Ui.” While we understand that at some times and places “U” and “V” were used interchangeably, we questioned if 14th Century Scotland might be a little late for this. Not knowing Scottish orthography, we bow to Arval’s greater expertise.
Thorvald:
We count only two legs. If this should be returned for redrawing on
the frog, please encourage the client to enlarge the size of the checks
too.
Knut: Quarterly checky azure and argent and Or, a frog salient vert.
Richenda: Consider a possible
conflict with Baston de l’Abbey, Checky gules and argent, a frog
salient vert. There is only 1 CD for the change to the field. In
addition, we have a few style comments for this armory. 1. The checks
on the checky part of the field could be larger and fewer. 2. This frog
is neither salient nor sejant but is partway between. A salient from
should look as though it were caught leaping. A sejant frog should
look as though it were sitting. The upper half of this frog looks as
though it were leaping and the bottom half as though it were sitting.
Blurring the line between two postures has long been reason for return.
3. When drawing a creature, it is customary for all four limbs to be
visible, especially when the posture is salient or rampant. We recommend
returning this for the conflict and advising the submitter to modify
the drawing.
Ćlfreda: We are not certain
if the primary charge is actually salient. It might be better described
as sejant erect.
If the primary is salient,
we find conflict with Gaston de l'Abbaye (reg 12/90) "Checky gules
and argent, a frog salient vert." There is one CD for changing
the field.
9) Northshield, Principality of. New Badge. Per pale sable and argent, a compass rose between two pomegranates slipped and leaved counterchanged.
Badge Commentary
Knut: Per pale sable and argent, a compass rose between in fess two pomegranates counterchanged.
Ary: When it says "a
compass rose between two pomegranates" are they in fess or in pale?
Is the compass rose the same size as the pomegranates, or is it clearly
a case of a primary surrounded by two secondaries? In any case, I'd
recommend a reblazon to something like "a compass rose between
in fess two pomegranates" (or in pale if that's what it is), or
"in fess a compass rose between two pomegranates" if they're
all the same visual weight.
Ćlfreda: We believe the pomegranites
should be blazoned "slipped and leaved".
10) Otto Helmsmid. Device Resubmission. Gules, an amphisbaena between three anvils Or
Knut: Gules, an amphisbaena between three anvils Or
Richenda: We believe this
to be clear of Joseph the Good, Gules, a Japonese dragon volant Or.
We are not sure if an amphisbena is a complete change of type or only
a CD from a dragon. We count the following CDs: field, posture and
type(?).
Ćlfreda: With the redrawing,
there may be a conflict with Abraham ben Aaron (reg 7/80) "Gules,
two Sassanian horned winged demi-lions statant addorsed conjoined Or."
There is one CD for addition of the anvils, but we are uncertain if
there is a CD between these two types of conjoined, winged monsters.
11) Rhonwen ferch Tewdwr. New Device. Azure, three chevronels interlaced argent overall a wyvern displayed Or.
Knut: Azure, three chevronels interlaced argent overall a wyvern displayed Or.
Richenda: This appears to be
clear.
12) Roana de Hauekrig. New Name and Device. Per chevron azure and vert, in base a bird migrant to chief argent.
Richenda: We found the documentation
to be as stated in the LoI.
Ary: This is clear of Francesca of Bright Angel, (reg. 01/73), "Azure, a dove displayed, head elevated argent," with one CD for the field and one for the unforced placement of Roana's bird. It is clear of the House of Este (reg. 12/94 via Laurel), "Azure, an eagle displayed argent crowned Or" and Poland (reg. 12/94 via Laurel), "Gules, an eagle displayed argent crowned Or," with the same CDs; there is no CD for the crowning on the birds, and also none for migrant vs. displayed:
Thorvald: How do you know
this is a hawk? We cannot distinguish what type of bird this is. Migrant
to chief is default, so we should drop the “to chief”.
Knut: Per chevron azure and vert, in base a hawk migrant to chief argent.
Richenda: We do not feel this bird is a hawk. It is much more like a natural dove. As such, we believe it should be reblazoned as a bird. That said, we believe this is clear of Francesca of Bright Angel, Azure, a dove displayed head elevated argent. There is a CD for the change to the field and a second for the bird in base. This change of position is not forced; therefore should count as a second CD. If it does not, then they are in conflict per Dame Elsbeth’s precedent: